Re: Optical Photon Production by Scintillator Material, need help!

From: Vahan Petrosyan <vahan4033_at_gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2012 20:28:32 +0400

  Many Thanks Nick! If I find answer I will inform you about that.

I am studying fluka purely myself and need only some basic help that YOU
and other members helped me very much, many thanks all of them too!

btw. I need some basic help about Electronic Damage Calculation that I
posted many times but still no answer :(
If you have time can you take a look to that topic?

On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 5:27 PM, Nicholas Bolibruch <
nicholas.bolibruch_at_gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Vahan,
>
> I honestly don't know. Unless one of the developers wants to answer your
> question, I would have to do a bit more investigation to determine exactly
> how that WHAT(2) is calculated. This is the extent of my knowledge about
> the scintillator routines as I am usually modeling optical photons by using
> them as primaries. Sorry I don't have an answer for you, maybe the Fluka
> manual will be more clear.
>
> --Nick
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 3:29 AM, vahan petrosyan <vahan4033_at_gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Hi Nick. Thanks for your replay. It helped me much.
>>
>> One question remains obscure for me.
>> 1) How can one calculate WHAT(2) "fraction of deposited energy going
>> into i-th scin. photon emission" parameter?
>> 2) Should it be specified in scintillator material parameters or it
>> can be calculated indirectly from other parameters too, for example
>> luminosity and emission peak wavelength?
>>
>> I supposed formula Luminosity[ph/ev]*Energy(peak emission)[ev], am I
>> right?
>>
>> (I converted luminosity from [ph/Mev] to [ph/ev])
>>
>> On 12.12.2012 19:58, Nicholas Bolibruch wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Vahan, sorry I should have been more clear.
>>>>
>>>> >5) You need to set an appropriate upper and lower energy in the
>>>> USRBDX card >for binning the optical wavelengths. I usually use 1E-9
>>>> to 1E-8 initially.
>>>>
>>>> The USRBDX card for OPTIPHO needs to have the binning range set to
>>>> appropriate energies.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> >6) You may want to set an OPT-PROP (sdum blank) card to set an index
>>>> of >refraction, absorption and diffusion coefficients. This will
>>>> increase the >processing time per particle however.
>>>>
>>>> This should read "You want to set an OPT-PROP ...". From this card
>>>> you need to set _at least_ the absorption coefficient and the
>>>> material you're assigning the properties to (ie. YAG). Setting
>>>> diffusion coefficients will increase the time per particle.
>>>>
>>>> Attached is your last INP file modified to work. I include comments
>>>> on cards I've changed.
>>>>
>>>> --Nick
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Dec 12, 2012 at 5:23 AM, Vahan Petrosyan
>>>> <vpetrosyan_at_asls.candle.am <mailto:vpetrosyan_at_asls.**candle.am<vpetrosyan_at_asls.candle.am>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Many thanks for your help Nick!
>>>>
>>>> I did corrections that you mention and was able to get nice USRBDX
>>>> result for photons but not for optical ones. It still zeroes.....(:
>>>> I am attaching new corrected input file.
>>>>
>>>> As I understood from your explanation card OPT-PROP (sdum
>>>> WV-LIMITS) is
>>>> optional and card OPT-PROP (sdum SENSITIV ) is used only for
>>>> reducing
>>>> CPU load not for getting more precise results....?
>>>> I switched on also OPT-PROD (sdum SCINT-WV and WV-LIMITS) but
>>>> without
>>>> luck!
>>>> I am little confused about WHAT(2) ( "fraction") parameter of
>>>> OPT-PROD(
>>>> sdum SCINT-WV ), is it the same as /Luminosity [photons/Mev]???? /
>>>>
>>>> How can I get USRBDX distribution of optical photons?
>>>>
>>>> With regards V. Petrosyan!
>>>>
>>>> On 10.12.2012 21:44, Nicholas Bolibruch wrote:
>>>> > Hi Vahan,
>>>> >
>>>> > Here are the issues with your input:
>>>> >
>>>> > 1) your source is at 20 MeV, and is isotropic. If you test it
>>>> with a
>>>> > beam, make sure its in the positive direction, and set the
>>>> primaries
>>>> > lower as the processing time is ~2 hrs on an i7 if it's made
>>>> > directional with your current settings. Using the SENSITIV sdum
>>>> on
>>>> > OPT-PROP you can probably lower the OPT-PHOT production (and
>>>> reduce
>>>> > CPU load) if you are trying to make other measurements at the same
>>>> > time in your simulation.
>>>> >
>>>> > 2) when entering in the wavelengths for the OPT-PROP (sdum
>>>> WV-LIMITS)
>>>> > cards you want them in cm, they were all entered in as meters, you
>>>> > technically don't need them to run the simulation
>>>> >
>>>> > 3) same issue with OPT-PROD (sdum SCINT-WV), it was also in
>>>> meters.
>>>> > This card is very much needed.
>>>> >
>>>> > 4) you explained you want an electron beam. But you have the
>>>> source
>>>> > card set to isotropic at 20 MeV. :-)
>>>> >
>>>> > 5) You need to set an appropriate upper and lower energy in the
>>>> USRBDX
>>>> > card for binning the optical wavelengths. I usually use 1E-9
>>>> to 1E-8
>>>> > initially.
>>>> >
>>>> > 6) You may want to set an OPT-PROP (sdum blank) card to set an
>>>> index
>>>> > of refraction, absorption and diffusion coefficients. This will
>>>> > increase the processing time per particle however.
>>>> >
>>>> > Hope this helps.
>>>> >
>>>> > --Nick
>>>> >
>>>> > On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 7:11 AM, Vahan Petrosyan
>>>> > <vpetrosyan_at_asls.candle.am <mailto:vpetrosyan_at_asls.**candle.am<vpetrosyan_at_asls.candle.am>
>>>> >
>>>> <mailto:vpetrosyan_at_asls.**candle.am <vpetrosyan_at_asls.candle.am>
>>>> <mailto:vpetrosyan_at_asls.**candle.am <vpetrosyan_at_asls.candle.am>>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > I want to get optical photons distribution (angular,
>>>> energy) that
>>>> > irradiated by Yag screen ( scintillator material Yag(Ce)
>>>> yttrium
>>>> > aluminum garnet ) via USRBDX card when electron beam with
>>>> 5Mev energy
>>>> > hits it.
>>>> >
>>>> http://www.detectors.saint-**gobain.com/uploadedFiles/**
>>>> SGdetectors/Documents/Product_**Data_Sheets/YAG-Data-Sheet.pdf<http://www.detectors.saint-gobain.com/uploadedFiles/SGdetectors/Documents/Product_Data_Sheets/YAG-Data-Sheet.pdf>
>>>> >
>>>> > I want to define scintillator material properties with
>>>> fluka using
>>>> > OPT-PROD card with SCINT-WV option but fluka gives an error.
>>>> > I have never done such kind of simulation and need experts
>>>> help in
>>>> > order
>>>> > to do it correctly. I am attached my input file and ask you to
>>>> > look and
>>>> > say what I did wrong.
>>>> >
>>>> > btw. I played with parameters of my input file a little and
>>>> > switched on
>>>> > Cerenkov and Transition(TR-Radia) radiation and disable
>>>> OPT-PROD card
>>>> > with SCINT-WV in order to get some results but USRBDX plot
>>>> with option
>>>> > OPTIPHOT gives me an empty data range.
>>>> >
>>>> > can someone help me to define correct parameters for
>>>> scintillator
>>>> > material Yag(Ce) and get correct distribution (angular,
>>>> energy) of
>>>> > optical photons via USRBDX card?
>>>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Yttrium_aluminum_garnet<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yttrium_aluminum_garnet>
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks!
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
Received on Tue Dec 18 2012 - 21:24:01 CET

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